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Cutting edge conversation between Max Freakout and Cyber Disciple. In this episode Max and Cyb continue to discuss Plato, his philosophy and political involvement. Topics discussed include:

– Psychedelic initiation in ancient Greece
– Application of Platonism to religion
– The importance of rationality in Platonism, applying strict rationality to the psychedelic altered state
– Competitive nature of Socratic dialogues
– Socratic interrogation as metaphor for loosened cognition
– Platonic dualism – two-level system
– Geometric illustration of Platonic higher-level perfection
– The cave allegory and how it models multi-state cognition
– Unhelpfulness of the “real/unreal” binary distinction
– Plato’s Republic and the difficulties of integrating psychedelic initiation into society
– Comparison of Platonism with Christianity, their respective political motivations



This episode introduces the topic of altered state cybernetic/deterministic interpretation of Plato and Platonist philosophy. Topics covered include:
– The relation between Platonism and Christianity
– Plato as foundational figure behind academic philosophy
– The Platonist theme of unity transcending multiplicity appearing in Judeo-Christianity, Islam and Hinduism.
– The enhanced degree of rationality in Plato compared with earlier writers
– Socrates’ rhetorical style in the Platonic dialogues
– Socrates’ dialogue with the prophet Euthyphro on the nature of piety
– Platonism as a two-level system, initiated versus non-initiated interpretations, playful and humorous blending of levels.
– Unwritten esoteric platonist content equating the form of The Good with The One.
– Secrecy surrounding mystery initiation, experiential and verbal aspects of initiation
– The crime of profaning the Eleusinian mystery by revealing secret content
– The trial of Socrates, the precise nature of Socrates’ crime
– Political aspects of Platonist thought, democracy versus oligarchy
– Literal and metaphorical interpretations of Plato
– Age restrictions on mystery initiation
– Plato’s description of the ideal state governed by enlightened philosopher kings
– Competing interpretations of altered state phenomenology
– Maintaining the societal appearance of egoic freewill agency after initiation
– Academic taboo and censorship of psychedelic drug issue
– Michael Rinella, David Hilman and Carl Ruck’s writing about ancient drug use
– Plato’s cybernetic charioteer analogy for the human soul in the Phaedrus dialogue
– Fallacious single-state interpretation of Plato
– Possibility of access to the altered state for modern students of mysticism
– The alien-social-psychology theory of ancient altered state experiences, Anything-But-Drugs (ABD) explanations
– Ustinov’s theory that caves provided ancient people with access to the altered state, Plato’s cave allegory


A follow-up episode on Terence Mckenna. Topics include:

The pathway from Mckennaism towards metaphorical psychedelic eternalism
Reconciling Terence Mckenna’s ideas with the ego death theory
Terence’s understanding of esoteric religion
Terence’s tepid defence of free will
Different motives for defending free will and determinism
Undesirability of the no free will position
David Hilman’s problems with official academia when presenting psychedelic theories of ancient Greek culture
The process of scientific advancement, Kuhn and Popper versus Feyerabend
Michael Hoffman’s engineering background, his focus on model building and practical problem solving
Terence Mckenna’s criticism of scientific reasoning and inductivist logic
Terence’s status as a radical and critical thinker
Exotericism and sober meditation as substitute wish-fulfilment
Terence’s attitudes towards sober meditation
Michael Hoffman’s characterisation of psychedelic tripping as loosened cognition
Max Freakout’s process of intellectual development from Terence Mckenna to Michael Hoffman’s ego death theory
Mono-plant fallacy in Terence’s thinking, Terence’s dismissal of LSD
The entertaining quality of Terence’s thought
Lack of metaphor awareness in Terence’s thought
Modifying Terence’s ideas with metaphorical interpretive lense, similarity to Christianity


Comparison between Terence Mckenna and Tim Leary
Tension between metaphorical and literal interpretation of Mckenna’s ideas
Mckenna’s ‘Stoned Ape’ theory of human evolution
Brian Aker’s Lamarckist criticism of stoned ape theory
Differing views of Mckenna’s motivations
Mckenna’s criticism of scientism
Mckenna’s emphasis on natural drugs and dismissal of LSD
Mckenna’s feminist ideals
Mckenna’s analogical model of psychedelic cognition (explicit representationalism)
Mckenna’s model of time and reverse-causality and its relation to 4D block-universe determinism
Mckenna’s ‘timewave zero’ equation
2012 as teleological eschaton
Mckenna’s idea of accelerating ingression into novelty
Scientistic reliance on inductivist logic
Mckenna’s DMT induced ‘Machine Elves’, comparisons with religious myths such as prophet Jacob’s wrestling with an angel
Mckenna’s concept of telepathic communication
Mckenna’s rejection of psychedelic Christianity via dismissal of John Allegro and Leary’s Good Friday experiment


Cutting edge conversation between Max Freakout and Cyber Disciple. In this episode Max and Cyb plan subjects for future podcast episodes.

Topics covered include:
The various modern approaches towards psychedelia
Esotericism and exotericism
The similarity between plant-spirit shamanism (such as Santo Daime) and esoteric Christianity
Entheogenic and placebo eucharist
The link between exotericism and prohibitionism
The legal position of ayahuasca churches
Drug policy reform and prohibition repeal
Corrupt dishonest nature of drug prohibition
Exotericist drive to perpetually delay control-seizure and transcendent enlightenment
Awareness of entheogenic eucharist in modern churches
Insidern/Outsider dynamic in Christianity
Different attitudes towards conversion among exoteric religions
Determinism/free-will contradiction in exoteric religion
Terence Mckenna’s psychedelic ideas, his progressive and trippy thinking and his limitations
New age attitudes towards psychedelia
Quantum woo-woo
Psychedelic culture and social tolerance compared to LGBT lifestyle
Nese Devenot’s Mckenna inspired writing
Psychedelic psychotherapy and its relevance to the egodeath theory
Personal and transpersonal issues
Freud’s concept of substitute wish fulfilment and how it can be used to analyse exotericism
Freud’s theory of mythological interpretation, Oedipus and Electra


Cutting edge conversation between Max Freakout and Cyber Disciple. This episode is part two of a two-part analysis of neuroscience and its metaphysical basis. In this episode Max and Cyb talk about the philosophical issue of mind/matter substance dualism.

Topics covered include:
Dosage levels in Carhart-Harris’ psychedelic neuroscience study
Benny Shanon’s research into psychedelic phenomenology
The philosophy of mind/body dualism
The materialist and ordinary-state basis of the academic worldview
Negative academic attitudes towards metaphysical idealism per George Berkeley’s philosophy
Descartes’ conception of substance dualism
Deliberate ambiguity towards noumenal unreality (immateriality) in Kantian philososphy
Egoic self-negation in the intense altered state (ego death experience)
Virtual environment and the bubble of simulation
Schopenhauer’s idealism
Platonic idealism
Ordinary-state based category errors in commentaries on ancient philosophers like Plato
Donald Davidson’s philosophy of rational agency
Psychedelic metaperception and idealism
Mediated and unmediated perception, representation and referent
Tacit implications of Frank Jackson’s seminal paper ‘What Mary didn’t know’
Incomplete thinking in Andrew Letcher and Frank Jackson
Comparing Jackson’s neuroscientist Mary to Robin Carhart-Harris
Michael Rinella’s suggestion that Plato held a negative attitude towards altered-state revelation
Description of transcendent thought-injection in Plato’s dialogue with Ion
Comparing MRI brain scans to Kirlian photography depicting auras

Late posting, has been live for a week and a half

Part 1 on Psychedelic Neuroscience:


Begins with a review of the typical paradigms in contemporary pop psychedelia.

Main content of the episode is a critique of Martin Ball’s Entheological Paradigm as representative of New Age psychedelic spirituality.


In this episode we discuss our motivations in beginning this collaborative podcast and define the typical paradigms of contemporary pop psychedelia. Below is a list of the main topics and a variety of subtopics discussed throughout our conversation. This episode introduces our coming series focusing on each of the typical paradigms in turn.

The main topic covered is:

  • Identification of explanatory paradigms within popular psychedelia
    • Psychotherapy (e.g. MAPS)
    • Nonduality spirituality (e.g. Martin Ball’s Entheological Paradigm)
    • Neuroscience (e.g. recent research from Robin Carhart-Harris)
    • Entheogens in religious history
    • Drug Policy Reform
    • Plant-spirit Shamanism
Other topics discussed at points in our conversation, though not in this order, include:
  • The uptake of a radical new paradigm
    • altered state revision of implicit assumption frameworks; Psychedelics as “assumption revealers”; Plato’s cave allegory and its application to altered state phenomenology
    • Academic self-reinforcing feedback loops and resistance to radical paradigm revision; The entheogen-diminishing strategy of relegating entheogens to footnotes and introductions; The importance of placing entheogens front and centre in historical study; Academic scholarship vs. Internet scholarship
    • The distinction between Michael Hoffman’s writing style and the theoretical content
  • Physicalist and idealist perspectives on entheogens; Different versions of no-freewill; William Alston’s book on religious experiencing ‘Perceiving God’; Alston’s concept of ‘over-riders’ which invalidate religious experiences
  • Minimal, moderate and maximal theories of entheogen history
    • The effect of the altered state on ancient Greek culture; Interpreting classical literature in light of altered state dynamics; Botanical identification of entheogenic plants in ancient culture; Carl Ruck’s writing on ancient culture and entheogens; Luther Martin’s book ‘Hellenistic religion’ which emphasises heimarmene as a key concern of ancient religion; Over-emphasis on Eleusis in academic writings on ancient mystery religions; Michael Rinella’s book ‘Pharmakon’
    • Luke Timothy Johnson’s entheogen diminishment in his writing/speaking on Christianity; Limitations of John Allegro’s entheogenic theory of Christianity; Tom Hatsis’ writings on entheogen history and witchcraft; Hatsis’ dismissal of entheogen theory of Christianity; Hatsis’ study of scopolamine plants in ancient witchcraft practises



Complementing the first podcast, in this second one Max and I discuss his history with the Egodeath Theory.

Covers youthful exploration of psychoactive drugs, drug-induced control loss, developing interest in philosophy and theorizing, Psychonautica podcast and interview with Michael Hoffman, posting in online forums, relationship to pop psychedelia, obstructions to mainstream academic career in philosophy/religious studies, experience of learning the Egodeath theory Phase 1 and Phase 2.

Coming episodes include initial definition of prominent models of thinking in contemporary discussion of psychoactives and analysis of Martin Ball’s Entheological Paradigm.


Metaphorical Psychedelic Eternalism
July 2018
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